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Really-Basic Transfer Switch Question...
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Really-Basic Transfer Switch Question... (PeteCresswell) 05-06-2008
Posted by Pete C. on May 9, 2008, 10:46 pm
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"(PeteCresswell)" wrote:
>
> Per Solar Flare:
> >Transfer panels can be obtained with individual circuit transfers although
> >this is usually only seen in specialized generator packages. Most likely a
> >main switch transfer panel will be easily obtained with 16 or more
> >individual breakers. Buy the same kind and re-use your old breakers.
>
> I think the concept *may* be starting to soak in.
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> - The outside feed to the existing breaker box gets connected to
> a "transfer switch".
>
> - The transfer switch has two inputs and one output.
>
> - The output is, as above, routed to the breaker box.
>
> - One of the inputs is the outside feed as above.
>
> - The other input is a line to the generator.
>
> - When one flips the transfer switch, it cuts off the
> outside line and routes the generator's output to
> the breaker box.
>
> - One controls the max load on the generator partially by
> flipping breakers in the breaker box. e.g. For a single
> EU2000, AC=OFF, KitchenStove=OFF, ElectricDryer=OFF.
>
> - All of the above seems to me to imply a single "circuit"
> in the transfer switch
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> If the above is correct, what are multiple "circuits" on the
> transfer switch used for?
>
> Maybe to front end different things like AC, ElectricDryer,
> KitchenStove, and "everything else"....thereby relieving the
> operator of the need to flip breakers back-and-forth when
> going between gennie and outside power?
> --
> PeteCresswell

If you're feeding it with such a small generator, the little "GenTran"
style transfer switch units are a better choice. Those transfer switches
are available at both Lowe's and Depot, and not just in a package with a
generator. Since they let you individually switch each circuit they
service between utility and generator feeds they make it a lot easier to
do load management on a small generator than trying to make sure you
turn off the correct breakers before switching a whole panel transfer
switch. Some models also have Amp / Watt meters so you can monitor the
load.

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100030284&N=10000003+90401

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100045357&N=10000003+90401

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=182534-48019-30216BRK&lpage=none

Posted by Vaughn Simon on May 10, 2008, 8:19 am
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>
> If you're feeding it with such a small generator, the little "GenTran"
> style transfer switch units are a better choice. Those transfer switches
> are available at both Lowe's and Depot, and not just in a package with a
> generator. Since they let you individually switch each circuit they
> service between utility and generator feeds they make it a lot easier to
> do load management on a small generator than trying to make sure you
> turn off the correct breakers before switching a whole panel transfer
> switch. Some models also have Amp / Watt meters so you can monitor the
> load.
>
>
http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100030284&N=10000003+90401
>

That is how I do it! I have the 6-circuit Gen-Tran unit. One advantage or
that type of switch is that all of the wiring is done on the "user" side of your
branch circuit breakers. I think that makes the job safer and more in line with
skills of the amateur electrician. You are only dealing with #12 or 14 wire so
wiring is easy. The only down side is that you have a large number of
individual wires to connect inside your panel, (18 for the 6-circuit panel) but
the process is simple and repetitive.

Yes, I find it a bit limiting to only be able to power six circuits, but I
bought mine at a Home Depot "yellow tag" sale for a fraction of its value, so I
happily took what was available. Since it is conjectured, I can simply unplug
my Onan and plug a portable generator into the same panel if I have generator
trouble. This is a feature that has been very valuable to be in the past. As
already mentioned, the built-in wattmeter means I don't have to guess about load
management.

In short; even though I am a licensed electrician and can do it any way I want,
if I had the job to do over again I would still use that style switch.

Vaughn



Posted by (PeteCresswell) on May 10, 2008, 8:50 pm
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Per Pete C.:
>If you're feeding it with such a small generator, the little "GenTran"
>style transfer switch units are a better choice. Those transfer switches
>are available at both Lowe's and Depot, and not just in a package with a
>generator. Since they let you individually switch each circuit they
>service between utility and generator feeds they make it a lot easier to
>do load management on a small generator than trying to make sure you
>turn off the correct breakers before switching a whole panel transfer
>switch. Some models also have Amp / Watt meters so you can monitor the
>load.

We've got a rather large breaker box - that seems less than 50%
used. viz: http://tinyurl.com/3pn2e5

Would there be any sense in trying to install the transfer switch
in the same box? Seems like plenty room.... plus it would make
a cleaner installation.
--
PeteCresswell

Posted by Pete C. on May 11, 2008, 10:42 am
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"(PeteCresswell)" wrote:
>
> Per Pete C.:
> >If you're feeding it with such a small generator, the little "GenTran"
> >style transfer switch units are a better choice. Those transfer switches
> >are available at both Lowe's and Depot, and not just in a package with a
> >generator. Since they let you individually switch each circuit they
> >service between utility and generator feeds they make it a lot easier to
> >do load management on a small generator than trying to make sure you
> >turn off the correct breakers before switching a whole panel transfer
> >switch. Some models also have Amp / Watt meters so you can monitor the
> >load.
>
> We've got a rather large breaker box - that seems less than 50%
> used. viz: http://tinyurl.com/3pn2e5
>
> Would there be any sense in trying to install the transfer switch
> in the same box? Seems like plenty room.... plus it would make
> a cleaner installation.
> --
> PeteCresswell

No, it wouldn't meet code or any inspections. There are transfer
interlock kits available that install in some panels (I use one on my
Square D QO panel), but again, for your small generator I'd suggest that
the units with the individual transfer switches and load meters would be
easier to manage.

Posted by Bruce in alaska on May 10, 2008, 6:45 pm
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> - When one flips the transfer switch, it cuts off the
> outside line and routes the generator's output to
> the breaker box.
>
> - One controls the max load on the generator partially by
> flipping breakers in the breaker box. e.g. For a single
> EU2000, AC=OFF, KitchenStove=OFF, ElectricDryer=OFF.
>
> - All of the above seems to me to imply a single "circuit"
> in the transfer switch
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> If the above is correct, what are multiple "circuits" on the
> transfer switch used for?
>
> Maybe to front end different things like AC, ElectricDryer,
> KitchenStove, and "everything else"....thereby relieving the
> operator of the need to flip breakers back-and-forth when
> going between gennie and outside power?
> --
> PeteCresswell

One BIG problem, with the above IS:
If your Genset Output is significantly Smaller, than the normal load
of your house, then you have NO Over-Current Protection for the Genset.
If you make a small mistake, in your loading of the Genset, like
having Momma forget, and turn on the oven or starting the Microwave,
while vacuuming the bedroom, your going to let the MAGIC SMOKE out of
the Stator Windings of your Genset, at minimum, and end up with a pile
of Copper Slag in the Genend Housing, or burning the house down at a
Maximum. You really need to have an appropriately sized Breaker between
the Genset and the Transfer Switch, to protect the Genset from
Over-Current. (appropriately being Genset Maximum Current Rating, plus
say 5%)

--
Bruce in alaska
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