Posted by Michael B on January 16, 2010, 4:59 am
> On Wed, 13 Jan 2010 17:42:23 -0800 (PST), Michael B
> >No.
> >The field strength is related to the number of coils.
> >So if I start out and go around the coil form 2,000
> >times with one wire, could I get the same effect by
> >using a multistrand, with each strand insulated
> >from the adjacent one?
> ---
> Well, finally, something that makes sense! :-)
> Yes.
> ---
> >If I were to use a 10 strand
> >and only go around the coil form 200 times, would
> >it have the same effect?
> ---
> No.
> ---
> >Litz wire would not have much current capacity,
> ---
> Litz wire is simply insulated wire stranded in a peculiar way in order
> to reduce skin effect, and can have any current capacity required for
> the application at hand.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Litz_wire
> >but would it have the same instantaneous magnetic field
> >from a capacitive discharge?
> For the initial spike:
> Version 4
> SHEET 1 880 680
> WIRE 64 0 0 0
> WIRE 224 0 128 0
> WIRE 224 32 224 0
> WIRE 0 128 0 0
> WIRE 224 160 224 112
> WIRE 0 288 0 208
> WIRE 224 288 224 240
> WIRE 224 288 0 288
> WIRE 0 368 0 288
> FLAG 0 368 0
> SYMBOL ind 208 144 R0
> SYMATTR InstName L1
> SYMATTR Value 1e-3
> SYMBOL res 208 16 R0
> SYMATTR InstName R1
> SYMATTR Value 1000
> SYMBOL cap 128 -16 R90
> WINDOW 0 0 32 VBottom 0
> WINDOW 3 32 32 VTop 0
> SYMATTR InstName C1
> SYMATTR Value 1e-9
> SYMBOL voltage 0 112 R0
> WINDOW 3 24 104 Invisible 0
> WINDOW 123 0 0 Left 0
> WINDOW 39 0 0 Left 0
> SYMATTR InstName V1
> SYMATTR Value PULSE(0 10 0 1e-9)
> TEXT -34 392 Left 0 !.tran 1e-3
> ---
> >It's not a question of multiple solder joints along the way,
> >it would be a beginning, and an end, with wires soldered
> >together at those points only.
> ---
> If you use stranded wire to make a coil with all of the strands soldered
> together at the ends but insulated from each other at every other point,
> then the resistance of each strand will be the end-to-end resistance of
> the wire multiplied by the number of strands in the wire, and the
> current in each strand will be:
> 1
> Is = ----
> It
> where Is is the current in any strand and It is the total current in the
> wire.
> Since the strands are in parallel, the total resistance of the wire will
> be:
> 1
> Rt = ------
> Rs n
> where Rt is the total resistance of the wire,
> Rs is the resistance of a single strand, and
> n is the number of strands in the wire.
> Graphically, (View in Courier) for a raw 1000' length of seven strand
> enameled #10 AWG wire we have:
> |<----------1000 feet------------>|
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> while with the ends soldered together,:
> |<-----------1000 feet---------->|
> |<-------------1 ohm------------>|
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> Now, since I've answered your question courteously, would you extend me
> the courtesy of bottom posting a reply, please?
> JF
Thanks.
Lets me know I can't take a shortcut on another project.
Posted by John Fields on January 16, 2010, 6:19 pm
On Fri, 15 Jan 2010 20:59:31 -0800 (PST), Michael B
>Thanks.
---
You're welcome; my pleasure. :-)
---
>Lets me know I can't take a shortcut on another project.
---
Glad to be able to help.
JF
Posted by Josepi on January 14, 2010, 3:28 pm
NO. Not the same effect. If you soldered the ends of the multistrands you
would have 200 turns only. You would have 10 parallel coils sharing current,
unevenly, due to connection differences and differing reluctance between
strands.
For 2000 turns, you put the form in a hand drill, measure the gearing step
up ratio and count hand crank turns mentally. 2000 / 10 = 200 turns only.
No.
The field strength is related to the number of coils.
So if I start out and go around the coil form 2,000
times with one wire, could I get the same effect by
using a multistrand, with each strand insulated
from the adjacent one? If I were to use a 10 strand
and only go around the coil form 200 times, would
it have the same effect?
Litz wire would not have much current capacity, but
would it have the same instantaneous magnetic field
from a capacitive discharge?
It's not a question of multiple solder joints along the way,
it would be a beginning, and an end, with wires soldered
together at those points only.
> Well done!
> Do you have a lot of this multi-strand wire to use for a cheap price?
> I think it would make the winding too complicated. Instead of many turns
> you
> will have days of soldering connections to get all the strands in series.
> That's a huge lump you may not have room for.
Posted by John Fields on January 14, 2010, 5:05 pm
>NO. Not the same effect. If you soldered the ends of the multistrands you
>would have 200 turns only. You would have 10 parallel coils sharing current,
>unevenly, due to connection differences and differing reluctance between
>strands.
>For 2000 turns, you put the form in a hand drill, measure the gearing step
>up ratio and count hand crank turns mentally. 2000 / 10 = 200 turns only.
---
The snow hid it well.
he slipped and fell, the knife killed,
but there was no loss.
JF
Posted by ehsjr on January 14, 2010, 5:17 pm
John Fields wrote:
>
>
>>NO. Not the same effect. If you soldered the ends of the multistrands you
>>would have 200 turns only. You would have 10 parallel coils sharing current,
>>unevenly, due to connection differences and differing reluctance between
>>strands.
>>
>>For 2000 turns, you put the form in a hand drill, measure the gearing step
>>up ratio and count hand crank turns mentally. 2000 / 10 = 200 turns only.
>
>
> ---
> The snow hid it well.
> he slipped and fell, the knife killed,
> but there was no loss.
>
> JF
Nice.
A perfect center.
Hike you said, and it made sense,
most enjoyable.
Ed
XML site map
> >No.
> >The field strength is related to the number of coils.
> >So if I start out and go around the coil form 2,000
> >times with one wire, could I get the same effect by
> >using a multistrand, with each strand insulated
> >from the adjacent one?
> ---
> Well, finally, something that makes sense! :-)
> Yes.
> ---
> >If I were to use a 10 strand
> >and only go around the coil form 200 times, would
> >it have the same effect?
> ---
> No.
> ---
> >Litz wire would not have much current capacity,
> ---
> Litz wire is simply insulated wire stranded in a peculiar way in order
> to reduce skin effect, and can have any current capacity required for
> the application at hand.
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Litz_wire
> >but would it have the same instantaneous magnetic field
> >from a capacitive discharge?
> For the initial spike:
> Version 4
> SHEET 1 880 680
> WIRE 64 0 0 0
> WIRE 224 0 128 0
> WIRE 224 32 224 0
> WIRE 0 128 0 0
> WIRE 224 160 224 112
> WIRE 0 288 0 208
> WIRE 224 288 224 240
> WIRE 224 288 0 288
> WIRE 0 368 0 288
> FLAG 0 368 0
> SYMBOL ind 208 144 R0
> SYMATTR InstName L1
> SYMATTR Value 1e-3
> SYMBOL res 208 16 R0
> SYMATTR InstName R1
> SYMATTR Value 1000
> SYMBOL cap 128 -16 R90
> WINDOW 0 0 32 VBottom 0
> WINDOW 3 32 32 VTop 0
> SYMATTR InstName C1
> SYMATTR Value 1e-9
> SYMBOL voltage 0 112 R0
> WINDOW 3 24 104 Invisible 0
> WINDOW 123 0 0 Left 0
> WINDOW 39 0 0 Left 0
> SYMATTR InstName V1
> SYMATTR Value PULSE(0 10 0 1e-9)
> TEXT -34 392 Left 0 !.tran 1e-3
> ---
> >It's not a question of multiple solder joints along the way,
> >it would be a beginning, and an end, with wires soldered
> >together at those points only.
> ---
> If you use stranded wire to make a coil with all of the strands soldered
> together at the ends but insulated from each other at every other point,
> then the resistance of each strand will be the end-to-end resistance of
> the wire multiplied by the number of strands in the wire, and the
> current in each strand will be:
> 1
> Is = ----
> It
> where Is is the current in any strand and It is the total current in the
> wire.
> Since the strands are in parallel, the total resistance of the wire will
> be:
> 1
> Rt = ------
> Rs n
> where Rt is the total resistance of the wire,
> Rs is the resistance of a single strand, and
> n is the number of strands in the wire.
> Graphically, (View in Courier) for a raw 1000' length of seven strand
> enameled #10 AWG wire we have:
> |<----------1000 feet------------>|
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> |<------------7 ohms------------->|
> ---------------------------------
> while with the ends soldered together,:
> |<-----------1000 feet---------->|
> |<-------------1 ohm------------>|
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> | |
> +--------------------------------+
> Now, since I've answered your question courteously, would you extend me
> the courtesy of bottom posting a reply, please?
> JF