Posted by Dale E on October 2, 2007, 2:51 pm
dogbreath wrote:
>> `SEC. 2. DEFINITIONS.
>> `(a) In General- For purposes of this subtitle--
>> `(5) GROSS PAYMENTS- The term `gross payments' means
>> payments for taxable property or services, including
>> Federal taxes imposed by this title.
>>http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c110:H.R.25 :
>> `SEC. 101. IMPOSITION OF SALES TAX.
>> `(a) In General- There is hereby imposed a tax on the
>> use or consumption in the United States of taxable
>> property or services.
>> `(b) Rate-
>> `(1) FOR 2007- In the calendar year 2007, the rate of
>> tax is 23 percent of the gross payments for the
>> taxable property or service.
>>
>
> Here, figure it correctly:
>
> SalesPrice = 0.23SalesPrice + CostOfGoods
> SalesPrice - CostOfGoods = 0.23SalesPrice
> -CostOfGoods = -SalesPrice + 0.23SalesPrice
> CostOfGoods = SalesPrice - 0.23SalesPrice
> CostOfGoods = 0.77SalesPrice
> CostOfGoods/0.77 = SalesPrice
>
> CostOfGoods = $77.00
> 77/0.77 = 100
> Jeffrey
I'll type r-e-a-l s-l-o-w so you can keep up.
I'll even use YOUR figures.
SalesPrice = $100.00
CostOfGoods = $77.00
SalesPrice - CostOfGoods = Tax
$100.00 - $77.00 = $23.00
Thus:
Using YOUR (correct by the law) figures:
SalesPrice = $100.00
CostOfGoods = $77.00
Tax = $23.00
Give any person a state tax rate of 8% and a cost of goods of $77.00
and they will correctly figure that the amount to be paid, that the
amount you call "SalesPrice" is going to be $83.16
State sales tax 8%.
Cost of goods $77.00
$77.00 X .08 = $6.16
$77.00 + $6.16 = $83.16
Amount to be paid = $83.16
Give any person a [] tax rate of 23% and a cost of goods of $77.00 and
they will figure [] that the amount to be paid, the amount you call
"SalesPrice" is going to be $94.71
State sales tax 23%.
Cost of goods $77.00
$77.00 X .23 = $17.71
$77.00 + $17.71 = $94.71
Amount to be paid = $94.71
Now pay attention, this is the part where I expose your lie.
The results of the average person's calculation of the tax:
SalesPrice = $94.71
CostOfGoods = $77.00
Tax = $17.71
The results of YOUR calculation using the formula in the law:
SalesPrice = $100.00
CostOfGoods = $77.00
Tax = $23.00
Which figure do you think the citizens will believe is the correct
answer?
I'm sorry Mr./Ms. purchaser, you need to give me another $5.29 to
complete your sale.
$23.00 - $17.71 = $5.29
Now how is the average citizen to get an answer that matches yours?
(And the answer that is correct according to the weasel worded law?)
The answer is to multiply the cost of goods by 29.87013%
Sales tax 23% (bullshit)
Cost of goods $77.00
$77.00 X .2987013 = $23.0000001
$77.00 + $23.00 = $100.00
BTW, the real reason for the NRST is because too many people are
actually reading the actual federal tax statutes and finding out that
they don't owe any federal income tax at all.
Posted by no spam on October 3, 2007, 9:38 am
> no spam wrote:
>>
>> >> > In the case of the fair tax, no matter how you calculate it, most
>> >> > people will end up paying less tax then they do now....which means
>> >> > more money in their pockets then they have under the present tax
>> >> > system....thanks for listening to my thoughts....have fun......sno
>> >>
>> >> This is the biggest load of horse pucky that the fair tax people pump
>> >> out.
>> >> There no way that it can bring in the same amount of money AND people
>> >> to
>> >> pay
>> >> less in taxes. If you check the federal tax system now there is a
>> >> large
>> >> number of people who pay no income tax or pay a very low rate. The
>> >> last
>> >> time I checked (about 3 years ago) I paid about 6% in income tax or
>> >> quite
>> >> a
>> >> bit less than $75K. Now you are telling me I'm going to have to pay
>> >> FOUR
>> >> TIMES or 400% more but most people will be paying less. Again I say
>> >> horse
>> >> pucky!
>> >
>> > You are paying the corporate tax on goods (15-35%) plus social
>> > security....
>> > medicare/medicade and who knows what else.....estimate is around
>> > average
>> > of 40 percent or so of most peoples income....(not including state/city
>> > taxes).....we went over 50 percent of income (for both federal/state)
>> > a few years back....fair tax does away with all withholdings
>> > from your wages and does away with the corporate tax that you pay...
>> > (corporate tax is included in price of goods, so you pay it)......you
>> > are also paying for those who do not pay any taxes underground
>> > economy...when you add them all together you can lower the tax people
>> > really pay.....not just what shows up in the income tax....
>>
>> And you think all these taxes are going to go away and stay away? Read
>> your
>> history about the income tax.
>>
>> If you want a really fair tax then you have to get rid of the 'prebate'
>> so
>> that EVERYONE pays the same percentage or a flat tax with no deductions.
>> Until then you just have another way for congress to buy votes by making
>> the
>> prebate bigger and linking its size to your yearly income so that the
>> more
>> money you make the more you get screwed. IOW, just like the system we
>> have
>> now but with no way to keep from getting screwed.
>>
>> Also I'm paying a huge 'lawyer tax' on everything because of lawsuits how
>> do
>> you plan to get rid of those?
> Hey, if you want to repeat the french revolution and overthrow
> everything that
> is wrong at the same time....or try to....start pushing for it.....
I don't see any need for that. In a few years the system will either HAVE
to be fixed or it will crumble under its own weight. There's no way that we
can continue going the way we are. At some point the taxes will be so much
of a burden on those few paying it that they will say 'screw it' and either
leave the country, if they can afford it (as they seem to be starting to do
in England) or just stop producing money.
To be honest with you I see it happening fairly quickly and am trying to
make sure the only 'pay or lose everything' expense will be my real estate
taxes.
> Just because the fair tax will probably get as bad as the tax we have
> now over
> years, is no reason for us not to go for it.....in 50 yrs or so if it
> gets as
> bad as now, then they can follow our example and fix it somehow...
I think you are off a bit. It wouldn't take them a year before they started
"fixing" it and with in less than 10 years it would be in the same sorry
state it is now.
Posted by Jim on October 2, 2007, 10:23 am
>> No small wonder the entire world seems to be emigrating to the US.
>> Very
>>few people ever leave, and that is just the export of liberals to
>>Canada.....
>>
> Can you cut that out? We don't need 'em.
Unfortunately, it is illegal to shoot them.....
> Gordon Richmond
Posted by Arnold Walker on October 2, 2007, 10:57 am
>>
>>> No small wonder the entire world seems to be emigrating to the US.
>>> Very
>>>few people ever leave, and that is just the export of liberals to
>>>Canada.....
>>>
>>
>>
>> Can you cut that out? We don't need 'em.
> Unfortunately, it is illegal to shoot them.....
I don't know ....they seem to be doing just that in all the school shootings
and gang fights.Even have lawyers defending against capital punishment of
these liberals.
Remember one case here in Texas,you had a serial killer who thought that
being on death row
for 30 years was cruial and unsual punishment.And needed to be released.The
judge noted that
he chose to be there instead of executed,with his many appeals.Other wise he
would have died
many years ago.His excution went as scheduled a couple of months later.
Then you have Celib's like Senator Kennedy and OJ setting the stage for what
we should be like.....
>>
>> Gordon Richmond
>
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Posted by Trygve Lillefosse on October 3, 2007, 1:13 pm
>>>> and in mainland Europe it's about 50%.
>>>Yes , and on top of that, here in Denmark we pay 25% VAT on everything.
>>>we pay 7$ for 1 gallon of 95oct. unleaded gas. (25% product price 75% green
tax and vat)
>>
>> It's more in dollars now. Remember that the dollar is quite weak at
>> the moment. (less than NOK 5.50)
>I know, i used 5,28 DKR. to 1$
Ok. Its around $8/gal in Norway.
>>>Cars gets 200-300% tax on top of normal sales price.
>>
>> 2-300% ?
>> Sounds a bit exagerated...
>> Tought it was only slightly higher than in Norway.
>> In Norway it's normaly around 100% or thereabout, depending on engine
>> size and weight.
>Maybe a little but not much.
>http://borger.dk/forside/transport/biler-og-andre-koeretoejer/afgifter-paa-koeretoejer
>"Afgiften er 105 pct. af de første 64.200 kr. og 180 pct. af resten"
>Translation: The sales tax is 105% on the first 12.000$ and 180% on the
remaining.
>So first 25% Vat and then 180%
>A Mercedes-Benz E200 man. at 243.063 dkr, end up at 769.025,- kr. including
registration tax and vat.
>http://www2.mercedes-benz.dk/content/media_library/denmark/passenger_cars/products/priser/e-klasse_benzin.object-Single-MEDIA.download.tmp/E-Klasse_Benzin_nyefradrag.pdf
<gibberish>
Det var mye høyere enn jeg hadde trodd. I Norge får du dem fra NOK
453.400.-
http://www.mercedes-benz.no/content/norway/mpc/mpc_norway_website/no/no_splashpage/home/home/products/new_cars/e_class_models.html
Antar de er nokså likt ustyrt.
Hmm.
Ifølge denne prislisten, er den billigste bilen en E200 CDI manuell
til 466.000
(pdf)
http://www.mercedes-benz.no/content/media_library/norway/passenger_cars/prislister/e-klasse_bil-_og_utstyrsprisliste.object-Single-MEDIA.download.tmp/E-Klasse%20Bil-%20og%20utstyrsprisliste%20-%20Juni%202007.pdf
Det skal sies at de fleste Mercedeser har fått *mindre* avgifter
(opptil 60.000) etter en omlegging sist nyttår. Det er først og fremst
dieselbiler som har fått redusert avgiftene. Nå har verdien mye mindre
å si. Det er CO2-utslipp og vekt en betaler for. +25% av importpris.
</gibberish>
>A 46,000$ car ends up at 146,200$
In Norway
petrol: $87.000
Diesel: $88.200
--
SEE YA !!!
Trygve Lillefosse
AKA - Malawi, The Fisher King
>> `(a) In General- For purposes of this subtitle--
>> `(5) GROSS PAYMENTS- The term `gross payments' means
>> payments for taxable property or services, including
>> Federal taxes imposed by this title.
>>http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c110:H.R.25 :
>> `SEC. 101. IMPOSITION OF SALES TAX.
>> `(a) In General- There is hereby imposed a tax on the
>> use or consumption in the United States of taxable
>> property or services.
>> `(b) Rate-
>> `(1) FOR 2007- In the calendar year 2007, the rate of
>> tax is 23 percent of the gross payments for the
>> taxable property or service.
>>
>
> Here, figure it correctly:
>
> SalesPrice = 0.23SalesPrice + CostOfGoods
> SalesPrice - CostOfGoods = 0.23SalesPrice
> -CostOfGoods = -SalesPrice + 0.23SalesPrice
> CostOfGoods = SalesPrice - 0.23SalesPrice
> CostOfGoods = 0.77SalesPrice
> CostOfGoods/0.77 = SalesPrice
>
> CostOfGoods = $77.00
> 77/0.77 = 100
> Jeffrey