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Posted by Eeyore on August 13, 2009, 3:33 pm
pautrey2 wrote:
> New Volt should get 230 mpg in city, GM says
A phoney measure of mpg.
Graham
--
due to the hugely increased level of spam please make the obvious
adjustment to my email address
Posted by Joesepi on August 13, 2009, 3:55 pm
How many km per kWh though?
How big are the peddles?
> pautrey2 wrote:
>> New Volt should get 230 mpg in city, GM says
> A phoney measure of mpg.
> Graham
> --
> due to the hugely increased level of spam please make the obvious
> adjustment to my email address
>
Posted by Speeders & Drunk Drivers are M on August 14, 2009, 5:49 pm
> New Volt should get 230 mpg in city, GM says
>
>
> The mileage for the electric-gas hybrid, due next year, would be the
> best by far of any car rated by the EPA.
> By Martin Zimmerman
> 1:21 PM PDT, August 11, 2009
>
>
> General Motors Co. said today that its long-awaited Chevrolet Volt
> plug-in hybrid is expected to achieve fuel economy of 230 miles per
> gallon in city driving.
>
> That would give the Volt, which is expected to arrive in showrooms
> late next year, by far the highest fuel efficiency rating of any car
> now rated by the Environmental Protection Agency. The current EPA
> mileage leader is the Toyota Prius hybrid, which is rated at 50 mpg in
> combined city-highway driving.
>
>
> The Volt is designed to run on electric power only for about 40 miles,
> after which a small gasoline engine kicks in to re-charge the battery,
> giving it a total range of more than 300 miles. The battery can be
> recharged by plugging in to a home outlet.
>
> GM's estimated mileage rating for the Volt is based on city driving.
> Highway mileage likely would be lower because it would require more
> work from the gasoline engine.
>
> "From the data we've seen, many Chevy Volt drivers may be able to be
> in pure electric mode on a daily basis without having to use any gas,"
> said GM Chief Executive Fritz Henderson. "EPA labels are a yardstick
> for customers to compare the fuel efficiency of vehicles. So, a
> vehicle like the Volt that achieves a composite triple-digit fuel
> economy is a game-changer."
>
>
> The automaker's fuel economy estimates still have to be confirmed by
> the EPA, which is developing a new methodology for calculating fuel
> economy ratings for cars that can travel significant distances powered
> only by electricity. GM said it used the EPA's preliminary guidelines
> in developing its mileage estimates for the Volt.
>
> The EPA publishes mileage estimates for vehicles sold in the U.S.
> based on city and highway driving, as well as a combined city-highway
> mileage estimate.
>
> The Volt's best fuel economy will be achieved in city driving, where
> it can take full advantage of its all-electric capability. GM said it
> has calculated a highway mileage estimate for the Volt, but didn't
> release the figure. The automaker said it was confident the car's
> combined city-highway fuel economy "will be in the triple digits."
>
> Electric-vehicle proponents, although encouraged by the Volt's
> preliminary numbers, cautioned GM not to overstate the car's
> capabilities.
>
> "The phrase 'Your mileage may vary' is particularly true with plug-in
> hybrids because how you drive will have a significant impact on how
> much gasoline the vehicle consumes," said Jim Kliesch, a senior
> engineer with the Union of Concerned Scientists.
>
> "It would be a real shame if such a promising technology got a bad rap
> because they raised expectations too high."
>
> The company said today it has produced about 30 Volts and is making 10
> a week at its pre-production facility in Warren, Mich. GM is expected
> to announce later this week that the Volt's nearly 400-pound lithium-
> ion battery will be assembled at a plant in the Detroit area. The
> production version car will be built at GM's Detroit-Hamtramck
> assembly plant.
>
> As the pre-production vehicles are road-tested, estimates of the cars'
> all-electric range and their eventual fuel economy rating could
> change. Volts currently are being road-tested in Yuma, Ariz., to gauge
> their performance in hot weather conditions.
>
> GM has staked much of its technological reputation on the Volt, and
> has touted the vehicle relentlessly for more than two years. Some
> critics have derided the vehicle as an expensive piece of "vaporware"
> that would never achieve significant sales, but the automaker has
> consistently maintained that it is committed to the Volt.
>
> "Right now, there are no foreseeable roadblocks to the program and the
> program's timing," GM spokesman Rob Peterson said.
>
> Although GM has not released pricing information on the Volt, industry
> analysts estimate it will cost about $0,000, though the automaker
> says the car's list price would likely be lowered by federal tax
> credits and other incentives. Peterson said Volt owners would be
> eligible for the $,500 federal tax credit provided on electric
> vehicles.
>
> Several other automakers, including Chrysler, Nissan, Ford and Toyota,
> are working on variations of plug-in hybrids or all-electric vehicles
> that are expected to reach the market over the next few years.
>
> martin.zimmerman@latimes.com
This news reminds me of BUSH and you hyped about sending men to =
MARS....back in 2004, so how many men have you successfully sent to =
MARS?
In fact, I see you hyped more than the Chinese.
Posted by BradGuth on August 16, 2009, 7:31 pm
> New Volt should get 230 mpg in city, GM says
> The mileage for the electric-gas hybrid, due next year, would be the
> best by far of any car rated by the EPA.
> By Martin Zimmerman
> 1:21 PM PDT, August 11, 2009
> General Motors Co. said today that its long-awaited Chevrolet Volt
> plug-in hybrid is expected to achieve fuel economy of 230 miles per
> gallon in city driving.
> That would give the Volt, which is expected to arrive in showrooms
> late next year, by far the highest fuel efficiency rating of any car
> now rated by the Environmental Protection Agency. The current EPA
> mileage leader is the Toyota Prius hybrid, which is rated at 50 mpg in
> combined city-highway driving.
> The Volt is designed to run on electric power only for about 40 miles,
> after which a small gasoline engine kicks in to re-charge the battery,
> giving it a total range of more than 300 miles. The battery can be
> recharged by plugging in to a home outlet.
> GM's estimated mileage rating for the Volt is based on city driving.
> Highway mileage likely would be lower because it would require more
> work from the gasoline engine.
> "From the data we've seen, many Chevy Volt drivers may be able to be
> in pure electric mode on a daily basis without having to use any gas,"
> said GM Chief Executive Fritz Henderson. "EPA labels are a yardstick
> for customers to compare the fuel efficiency of vehicles. So, a
> vehicle like the Volt that achieves a composite triple-digit fuel
> economy is a game-changer."
> The automaker's fuel economy estimates still have to be confirmed by
> the EPA, which is developing a new methodology for calculating fuel
> economy ratings for cars that can travel significant distances powered
> only by electricity. GM said it used the EPA's preliminary guidelines
> in developing its mileage estimates for the Volt.
> The EPA publishes mileage estimates for vehicles sold in the U.S.
> based on city and highway driving, as well as a combined city-highway
> mileage estimate.
> The Volt's best fuel economy will be achieved in city driving, where
> it can take full advantage of its all-electric capability. GM said it
> has calculated a highway mileage estimate for the Volt, but didn't
> release the figure. The automaker said it was confident the car's
> combined city-highway fuel economy "will be in the triple digits."
> Electric-vehicle proponents, although encouraged by the Volt's
> preliminary numbers, cautioned GM not to overstate the car's
> capabilities.
> "The phrase 'Your mileage may vary' is particularly true with plug-in
> hybrids because how you drive will have a significant impact on how
> much gasoline the vehicle consumes," said Jim Kliesch, a senior
> engineer with the Union of Concerned Scientists.
> "It would be a real shame if such a promising technology got a bad rap
> because they raised expectations too high."
> The company said today it has produced about 30 Volts and is making 10
> a week at its pre-production facility in Warren, Mich. GM is expected
> to announce later this week that the Volt's nearly 400-pound lithium-
> ion battery will be assembled at a plant in the Detroit area. The
> production version car will be built at GM's Detroit-Hamtramck
> assembly plant.
> As the pre-production vehicles are road-tested, estimates of the cars'
> all-electric range and their eventual fuel economy rating could
> change. Volts currently are being road-tested in Yuma, Ariz., to gauge
> their performance in hot weather conditions.
> GM has staked much of its technological reputation on the Volt, and
> has touted the vehicle relentlessly for more than two years. Some
> critics have derided the vehicle as an expensive piece of "vaporware"
> that would never achieve significant sales, but the automaker has
> consistently maintained that it is committed to the Volt.
> "Right now, there are no foreseeable roadblocks to the program and the
> program's timing," GM spokesman Rob Peterson said.
> Although GM has not released pricing information on the Volt, industry
> analysts estimate it will cost about $0,000, though the automaker
> says the car's list price would likely be lowered by federal tax
> credits and other incentives. Peterson said Volt owners would be
> eligible for the $,500 federal tax credit provided on electric
> vehicles.
> Several other automakers, including Chrysler, Nissan, Ford and Toyota,
> are working on variations of plug-in hybrids or all-electric vehicles
> that are expected to reach the market over the next few years.
> martin.zimmer...@latimes.com
If you exclude the HVAC and the kw load worth of a nifty surround
sound system, and only commute to/from within the 40 mile all-electric
range, you could get a million miles per gallon.
However, more than likely they'll be lucky to achieve an objective 101
empg, excluding the near future of the average national expense of
$.25/kwhr for battery recharging, as well as excluding their spendy
proprietary cost of battery replacement cost/mile (plus those
federally subsidized recharging station installations [home, office
and remote] plus the necessary power grid beef-up and of course
battery recycling fiasco).
Brad Guth, Brad_Guth, Brad.Guth, BradGuth, BG / Guth Usenet
Posted by vaughn on August 16, 2009, 10:22 pm
> New Volt should get 230 mpg in city, GM says
> The mileage for the electric-gas hybrid, due next year, would be the
> best by far of any car rated by the EPA.
> By Martin Zimmerman
> 1:21 PM PDT, August 11, 2009
> General Motors Co. said today that its long-awaited Chevrolet Volt
> plug-in hybrid is expected to achieve fuel economy of 230 miles per
> gallon in city driving.
> That would give the Volt, which is expected to arrive in showrooms
> late next year, by far the highest fuel efficiency rating of any car
> now rated by the Environmental Protection Agency. The current EPA
> mileage leader is the Toyota Prius hybrid, which is rated at 50 mpg in
> combined city-highway driving.
> The Volt is designed to run on electric power only for about 40 miles,
> after which a small gasoline engine kicks in to re-charge the battery,
> giving it a total range of more than 300 miles. The battery can be
> recharged by plugging in to a home outlet.
> GM's estimated mileage rating for the Volt is based on city driving.
> Highway mileage likely would be lower because it would require more
> work from the gasoline engine.
> "From the data we've seen, many Chevy Volt drivers may be able to be
> in pure electric mode on a daily basis without having to use any gas,"
> said GM Chief Executive Fritz Henderson. "EPA labels are a yardstick
> for customers to compare the fuel efficiency of vehicles. So, a
> vehicle like the Volt that achieves a composite triple-digit fuel
> economy is a game-changer."
> The automaker's fuel economy estimates still have to be confirmed by
> the EPA, which is developing a new methodology for calculating fuel
> economy ratings for cars that can travel significant distances powered
> only by electricity. GM said it used the EPA's preliminary guidelines
> in developing its mileage estimates for the Volt.
> The EPA publishes mileage estimates for vehicles sold in the U.S.
> based on city and highway driving, as well as a combined city-highway
> mileage estimate.
> The Volt's best fuel economy will be achieved in city driving, where
> it can take full advantage of its all-electric capability. GM said it
> has calculated a highway mileage estimate for the Volt, but didn't
> release the figure. The automaker said it was confident the car's
> combined city-highway fuel economy "will be in the triple digits."
> Electric-vehicle proponents, although encouraged by the Volt's
> preliminary numbers, cautioned GM not to overstate the car's
> capabilities.
> "The phrase 'Your mileage may vary' is particularly true with plug-in
> hybrids because how you drive will have a significant impact on how
> much gasoline the vehicle consumes," said Jim Kliesch, a senior
> engineer with the Union of Concerned Scientists.
> "It would be a real shame if such a promising technology got a bad rap
> because they raised expectations too high."
> The company said today it has produced about 30 Volts and is making 10
> a week at its pre-production facility in Warren, Mich. GM is expected
> to announce later this week that the Volt's nearly 400-pound lithium-
> ion battery will be assembled at a plant in the Detroit area. The
> production version car will be built at GM's Detroit-Hamtramck
> assembly plant.
> As the pre-production vehicles are road-tested, estimates of the cars'
> all-electric range and their eventual fuel economy rating could
> change. Volts currently are being road-tested in Yuma, Ariz., to gauge
> their performance in hot weather conditions.
> GM has staked much of its technological reputation on the Volt, and
> has touted the vehicle relentlessly for more than two years. Some
> critics have derided the vehicle as an expensive piece of "vaporware"
> that would never achieve significant sales, but the automaker has
> consistently maintained that it is committed to the Volt.
> "Right now, there are no foreseeable roadblocks to the program and the
> program's timing," GM spokesman Rob Peterson said.
> Although GM has not released pricing information on the Volt, industry
> analysts estimate it will cost about $0,000, though the automaker
> says the car's list price would likely be lowered by federal tax
> credits and other incentives. Peterson said Volt owners would be
> eligible for the $,500 federal tax credit provided on electric
> vehicles.
> Several other automakers, including Chrysler, Nissan, Ford and Toyota,
> are working on variations of plug-in hybrids or all-electric vehicles
> that are expected to reach the market over the next few years.
> martin.zimmer...@latimes.com
>If you exclude the HVAC
That can be very significant. Here in Florida, drivers are unlikely to
buy any car without AC
> and the kw load worth of a nifty surround sound system
Insignificant. (headlamps may be a different story)
>, and only commute to/from within the 40 mile all-electric range, you could
>get a million miles per gallon.
Yes, that is the problem. MPG is a meaningless metric for a car that has
more than one source of energy.
>However, more than likely they'll be lucky to achieve an objective 101
>empg
100+ MPG? Do you have anything to base that on?
>, excluding the near future of the average national expense of
>$.25/kwhr for battery recharging
Which should not be part of any MPG calculation. We need some new
metric to use to compare these new kinds of cars. MPG is meaningless when
more than one energy source is in play..
>, as well as excluding their spendy proprietary cost of battery replacement
>cost/mile.
Yes, all consumers should leave these cars in the showroom until the
manufacturer is willing to "come clean" and tell us what this the annual
and/or per-mile cost of the battery. That said, electric auto batteries
will not stay proprietary for long. A vigorous third-party market will
spring up as soon as there are sufficient customers. Auto manufacturers
would do well to encourage these folks, because this would give potential
e-vehicle consumers confidence that they will not end up with a usless lawn
decoration as soon as their warantee runs out.
> (plus those federally subsidized recharging station installations [home,
> officeand remote]
Where are they? I don't see any yet. I don't even see any serious
proposal. Did you just make that up?
>and of course battery recycling fiasco.
What "battery recycling fiasco"? Used-up rechargable batteries are a
valuable commodity. Just try to buy a new lead-acid battery without turning
in an old one. There are companies out there who will happily accept
used-up rechargable batteries of various chemistries. They will even supply
the packaging and pay the shipping.
Vaughn
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