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Posted by harry k on August 13, 2010, 3:12 pm

I wonder just  how they manage to get any life out of the unit.
Cavitation causes greatly increased erosion of metal surfaces.  cf
boat propellers, tubines, etc.

Harry K

Posted by hallerb@aol.com on August 13, 2010, 4:13 pm

I think the leaf should be designed with a nice optional trailer:)

Just hook up the mini trailer that includes a small efficent gasoline
engine when you must go long distances.

In normal use batteries only, long trips your all set:)

This would be the best of both worlds and add little to the leafs
cost, plus when the batteries age you can still get where you want to

Posted by daestrom on August 13, 2010, 4:50 pm

harry k wrote:



The trick is where the bubbles are when they collapse.  In
'conventional' situations like ship propellers and centrifugal pumps,
the low pressure bubbles form at the back sides of blades and collapse
right there.  So the inertia of the 'in rush' of water that fills the
bubble impacts the blading causing erosion.

Some 'super-cavitating' propellers and such are shaped such that the
bubbles break off the trailing edge of the blade / blade-tip before
collapsing.  So the inertial impact is not against the blade but rather
just against the water from the opposite side of the bubble.  Virtually
no erosion.

While these hydrosonic units claim that with the surfaces cooler (or at
least the same temperature) than the water, they aren't troubled by
scale.  I'm skeptical, since the dissolved solids have to go
'somewhere'.  I suppose the output is not really dry steam but rather
some wet steam/water mixture, so the TDS would be entrained in the
moisture.  That would mean you need external moisture-separators and
reclaim the heat from the hot 'brine' would be needed in some applications.

But any claim to be cheaper to heat water than resistance elements is
really dubious.  That would imply over unity (since resistance heating
is 100% efficient when it comes to heat-out / electric-energy-in.  Such
claims have always ended up being either not-reproducible or some form
of instrumentation error.


Posted by sno on August 13, 2010, 6:42 pm

On 8/13/2010 12:50 PM, daestrom wrote:

I followed the device from the beginning...some of the initial
installations of the device, when it replaced electrical heating found
around 10 percent decrease in their electric bills....it did not happen
in all installations...when griggs was questioned about it..he basically
said "I don't know, you figure it out"...a number of people came to
where he was building his device to determine what was happening I do
not know the qualifications of all the people but there were a number of
them, eventually griggs said "enough" and told them if they wanted to
study the device he would be glad to sell them one....I know of one that
was a physicist from the university of GA, as far as I know they all
measured over unity...no one at the time had any hypothesis as to why it
appeared to be over unity....(at the time little was known about
sonofusion) later it was hypothesized that this is what was
happening.....as far as I know no one has ever discovered for sure what
was happening....since it did not happen in all situations it was
hypothesized at the time it had something to do with the different water
at different locations...griggs never claimed over unity....and to this
day they do not make that claim...all they say is it is very
efficient...you may be able to go into the archives of
sci.physics.fusion and read of what was happening at the time....do not
remember the year/years...this is the only device I know of that has
been studied and appeared to be over unity....there used to be a video
on the web that showed what was happening inside the device....there
were zillions (grin) of little bubbles being produced if only a few of
them caused fusion then that would explain the effect....

hope helps....have fun.....sno

Correct Scientific Terminology:
Hypothesis - a guess as to why or how something occurs
Theory - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
  to be generally assumed to be true.
Law - a hypothesis that has been checked by enough experiments
  in enough different ways that it is assumed to be truer then a theory.
Note: nothing is proven in science, things are assumed to be true.

Posted by News on August 13, 2010, 11:31 pm

Scale will not migrate from a hotter liquid and build up on a cooler metal

There is more to the hydrosonic pump that what they are stating.  Results in
the field are superior to resistance heating.  They are simpler, merely
being a simple pump.

It would like to get my hands on a Moldavian unit.

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