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Posted by JosephKK on July 22, 2008, 10:41 pm
On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 14:41:14 -0700, "RST Engineering \(jw\)"
>We have some families up here, descendents of the original '49er miners,
>that claim to have kept it alive for the last 160 years.
>Jim
It is easy enough to do. Just be sure to wake it up and feed it once
a week or two.
Posted by JosephKK on July 22, 2008, 10:38 pm
On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 10:47:26 -0700, John Larkin
>On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 10:36:02 -0700 (PDT), James Arthur
>>> On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:53:21 -0700, John Larkin
>>>
>>> >And sourdough bread is made from flour and water, with maybe a little
>>> >salt.
>>>
>>
>>[snip]
>>
>>> It seems that you have never baked, let alone with sourdough.
>>
>>
>>How so? That's how I've been making my sourdough for the last decade
>>or so. Love the stuff.
>>
>>Cheers,
>>James Arthur
>I know a chinese guy who has had the same sourdough batch in his
>family for over 100 years. Whatever few bacteria were the original
>non-flour-non-water-non-salt ingredients, they must be parts per
>trillion now, if that. Nothing else has been added for thousands of
>dilutions, sort of like homeopathic medicines.
>Hmmm, what's (0.05)^1000 ?
>John
It is a life form sir, (lactobacteria acidophilus) it breeds.
Posted by JosephKK on July 22, 2008, 10:36 pm On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 10:36:02 -0700 (PDT), James Arthur
>> On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 13:53:21 -0700, John Larkin
>>
>>
>>
>> >wrote:
>>
>>
>> >>> ..
>> >>>> John Larkin wrote:
>> >>>>> On Wed, 16 Jul 2008 20:25:14 GMT, James Arthur
>>
>> >>>>>> Yes, but carbohydrates are so much easier to grow, and even easier
>> >>>>>> to subsidize. Hence their popularity.
>>
>> >>>>>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biofuel
>>
>> >>>> Sugar cane and its relatives are the ones to beat. Nothing else comes
>> >>>> close yet. We can also grow oil rich plants on marginal land. People
>> >>>> are playing with Jatropha for this although I don't envy the farmers
>> >>>> job.
>>
>> >>>>> About a billion people on this planet get insufficient carbohydrates
>> >>>>> to meet their body's needs. Burning food in SUVs and airplanes is
>> >>>>> grotesque. One bushel of corn, 65 pounds, makes a couple of gallons
>> >>>>> of ethanol. So refilling an Escalade could waste a half of a ton of
>> >>>>> food.
>>
>> >>>> I am in full agreement with you there. It also drives prices of grain
>> >>>> up out of reach of the poorest.
>>
>> >>>> Only the power of the US corn lobby could ever have got this one off
>> >>>> the ground. The end to end energy cost of making alcohol from grain
>> >>>> including all inputs is pretty awful. You get only about 10-20%
>> >>>> return if you are lucky. Sugar cane is more than 300% ROI and still
>> >>>> with scope for improvement.
>>
>> >>>> Regards,
>> >>>> Martin Brown
>>
>> >>> As a diabetic, the potential for a rise in refined sugar prices and
>> >>> a restriction in its availability, is not too alarming. But still
>> >>> there is that "Nutrasweet" and some other sugar substitutes have real
>> >>> sugar as a feed stock. I guess it could be said that the world, as a
>> >>> whole, can get along without it's main sweetener better than a major
>> >>> feed stock like corn and soy. The protein that the corn & soy
>> >>> eventually provides the world will keep people alive, the sugar?
>>
>> >>> Luck;
>> >>> Ken
>>
>> >>Ugh, and that nasty High Fructose Corn Syrup. The older I get, the fewer
>> >>processed foods I eat, not so much because I don't like cereal or so on,
>> >>but there is so much HFCS in the vast majority of products now that
>> >>they're inedible to me - I don't know how poeple can stomach the stuff.
>> >>Even something as simple as a Kaiser roll is now nauseatingly sweet.
>> >>I've gotten to where I'm starting to even make my own bread, that's how
>> >>disgusting most of the commercial items have gotten. And obesity is
>> >>described as being "an epidemic" among even young children. The last
>> >>thing we need is ever-more HFCS in everything. And studies indicate that
>> >>it is worse than regular sugar, something to do with it being iether
>> >>unrecognized ro poorly-recognized by the hormones that signal the brain
>> >>we're satiated. Not to mention that the hidden sugar only contributes to
>> >>obesity and type-II diabetes. I mean, why the heck does something like
>> >>*sausage* "need' to have HFCS added? IMO, it'd be a blessing if that
>> >>crap was turned into ethanol, because that'd mean less of it would be
>> >>going into food products.
>>
>> >>At least, that is my opinionated opinion ;)
>>
>> >Here, you can buy Mexican cokes, in glass bottles, made with real
>> >sugar. They're pretty good.
>>
>> >And sourdough bread is made from flour and water, with maybe a little
>> >salt.
>>
>[snip]
>> It seems that you have never baked, let alone with sourdough.
>How so? That's how I've been making my sourdough for the last decade
>or so. Love the stuff.
>Cheers,
>James Arthur
I love sourdough also. Made it regularly for about 2 decades. Then
tough times, contamination of the start and i killed it. It came from
an 1949 Alaskan start that family provided. When my schedule gets a
little better i will make a start from scratch.
Posted by Don Klipstein on July 21, 2008, 12:35 am
<SNIP all previously quoted material mainly to edit for space>
>Here, you can buy Mexican cokes, in glass bottles, made with real
>sugar. They're pretty good.
I have found a slight difference between Canadian Cokes and American
ones, in favor of usage of "Real Sugar"!
Canada gets sugar from Cuba. Why does USA need to put a wall between
itself and Cuba while trading with China as "most favored nation"?
>And sourdough bread is made from flour and water, with maybe a little
>salt.
>At least the trans-fat hydrogenated soybean oil is going away. That was
>really foul.
Make that "partially hydrogenated" - fully hydrogenated (less common)
is 100% saturated (bad enough) but "trans" is much worse while being a
type of unsaturated, found mainly in "partially hydrogenated" vegetable
oils (especially of soybean).
I say good riddance to that poison, in the few cities of USA where that
poison has recently been banned.
I find "partially hydrogenated" vegetable oils to be the main poisoning
in processed foods - and after that high salt content, low fiber content
and low content of antioxidants - even the more notable ones.
So I munch a lot of veggies and also more than "my fair share" of
berries and fruit.
- Don Klipstein (don@misty.com)
Posted by Vaughn Simon on July 21, 2008, 9:37 am
>Why does USA need to put a wall between
> itself and Cuba while trading with China as "most favored nation"?
One word answer: Politics.
A couple of years ago, the wife and I took a Caribbean cruise. Twice, our
ship stopped for Cubans on makeshift floating objects. Although our crew tried
to convince the Cubans to come aboard to safety, they all preferred their rafts.
Coming aboard would have meant their ultimate return to Cuba.
I will never forget that situation: Us on our ship with *everything*; them
on their raft with *nothing* (perhaps not even their lives). We did not want
aboard their raft, they did not want aboard our ship. What was the barrier
between us? Politics!
A few days later, Hurricane Wilma swept through that area and likely made
fish food out of some of those poor people.
Vaughn
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>that claim to have kept it alive for the last 160 years.
>Jim