Hybrid Car – More Fun with Less Gas

Standby Generator Starting in cold weather - Page 7

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Posted by Me on December 2, 2005, 12:55 am

 nospam.clare.nce@sny.der.on.ca wrote:

More like "Just a few" come with Ether Starting Systems, and it is
used on 2 cycle diesels, almost exclusivly.  Tell us all why the
use of ether makes diesels start in extreme cold Wx?  What is
it that makes ether work and regular starting proceedures not work
when the ambient temps are very low?

If you can, also expound to us all, just why ether is BAD for Gas
engines, and GOOD for diesels?  Show us all your intellectual prowess.


Posted by nospam.clare.nce on December 2, 2005, 6:50 am

OK - your snide remarks aside -
Ether lights a LOT easier than fuel oil - so when extremely cold, the
engine will warm the ether enough to fire by compression alone, while
the heat of compression is not adequate to light the fuel oil.  This
is particularly effective on engines that have either no glow plugs or
defective glow plugs.

When the ether lights it goes off with a fair amount of force - which
the deisel engine is strongly enough built to handle.

In a gasoline engine ether is not lit by compression temperature, but
by spark. The gasoline engine is not designed with as much strength,
as it is designed to run at considerably lower compression ratio, and
lower cyl pressures.  The burn rate/profile of a gasoline engine is
designed to provide a relatively slow rate of pressure rise, with max
pressure some 40 degrees after TDC.

Firing ether at some 10 degrees BTDC causes a VERY FAST RATE OF
PREASSURE INCREASE while the piston is still coming up. This can crack
pistons, bend rods, blow head gaskets, or crack heads. Or, with a
little bit of luck, and CAREFULL use, it will start a stubborn gas
engine as well.

Another problem with ether is it tends to wash the oil off the cyls.
This is more critical on gas engines because deisel fuel, being a
light oil, has lubricating properties that gasoline does not poses.

Also, I said many engines CAME with ether start. This is in the past.
Very few TODAY come with ether start. However, it was NOT ONLY 2
stroke deisel engines that came with ether start. It was available on
quite a few ag tractors with 4 stroke compression ignition engines -
Perkins and Cummins as well as some others.

The reason it was almost REQUIRED on the old 2 stroke jimmy is until
the engine was cranking at a good speed the blower did not have enough
effect to boost the compression pressures high enough on a very cold
engine to light the fuel. IIRC the ether was injected below the blower
on the Jimmy, directly into the manifold at the intake port. On
normally aspirated 4 stroke compression ignition engines ether is
generally injected into the intake at the air filter.
This is not adviseable, apparently, on turboed 4 strokes, particularly
with manifold mounted pre-heaters (as compared to port mounted glow

Posted by Me on December 2, 2005, 6:44 pm

 nospam.clare.nce@sny.der.on.ca wrote:

Ok, you have some knowledge of engine technology.  Thank you for
providing the Group with this information.


Posted by nospam.clare.nce on December 6, 2005, 2:16 am

I've only been a mechanic since 1969, and taught both high school and
trade level automotive technology for several years.
Did my apprenticeship in a general garage that was also a farm
equipment dealership, and worked for a time for an industrial
equipment shop (case/allis and several other brands)along with 10
years as service manager at a Toyota dealership.
Accumulated a TITTLE bit of knowlege about automobiles and other
motorized and mechanical contraptions.

Posted by Me on December 6, 2005, 7:17 pm

 nospam.clare.nce@sny.der.on.ca wrote:

and all the above makes you an expert on "Ether use in Extreme Low Temp
Starting of Diesel Engines", why?   When was the last time you lived in
-40F, and had to start a diesel engine?  There are a few in this group
who deal with this on a daily basis, and have for more years than you
have been out of square pants.....


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