Posted by markzoom on February 20, 2007, 7:49 pm
Just a thought...
The average air conditioning heat pump will output over 3 times the
input power in heat (in the heater configuration).
So how about having the wind turbine run a heat pump compressor
directly (no electricity)?
Without the additional heat fom the motor, that would be over twice
the rating of the wind turbine. IOW a 500 watt turbine should output
1kw of heat (or cold). Up to you wether it's used for heating water or
air.
The mast could double as the "radiator"/heat exchanger absorbing
ambient heat and you could have a fridge at the bottom of the turbine
as a bonus (with electrical backup for low wind days, obviously).
The question is:
How do heat pumps perform at variable speeds? Any refrigeration/ air
conditioning techs out there?
If the variable speed is a problem, any thoughts about solutions?
Posted by gfretwell on February 20, 2007, 10:03 pm
On 20 Feb 2007 16:49:13 -0800, markzoom@digiverse.net wrote:
>Just a thought...
>The average air conditioning heat pump will output over 3 times the
>input power in heat (in the heater configuration).
>So how about having the wind turbine run a heat pump compressor
>directly (no electricity)?
>Without the additional heat fom the motor, that would be over twice
>the rating of the wind turbine. IOW a 500 watt turbine should output
>1kw of heat (or cold). Up to you wether it's used for heating water or
>air.
>The mast could double as the "radiator"/heat exchanger absorbing
>ambient heat and you could have a fridge at the bottom of the turbine
>as a bonus (with electrical backup for low wind days, obviously).
>The question is:
>How do heat pumps perform at variable speeds? Any refrigeration/ air
>conditioning techs out there?
>If the variable speed is a problem, any thoughts about solutions?
Interesting idea. I would start by looking at autromotive style
compressors. These work from an idle to highway speed. They are off
the shelf items and you might find a good one in a juink yard to
experiment with. The problem is these things are typically 2 ton units
on an American car. That is a lot for a windmill to spin. Maybe one
from a small foreign car would work.
I don't know if the manufacturer's have specs somewhere on their sites
or not. Ask around at the auto parts places to see who the main
suppliers are these days for aftermarket compressors. They are more
likely to have specs available.
Posted by Jeff on February 21, 2007, 4:11 am
gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
> On 20 Feb 2007 16:49:13 -0800, markzoom@digiverse.net wrote:
>
>
>>Just a thought...
>>The average air conditioning heat pump will output over 3 times the
>>input power in heat (in the heater configuration).
>>So how about having the wind turbine run a heat pump compressor
>>directly (no electricity)?
>>
>>Without the additional heat fom the motor, that would be over twice
>>the rating of the wind turbine. IOW a 500 watt turbine should output
>>1kw of heat (or cold). Up to you wether it's used for heating water or
>>air.
>>
>>The mast could double as the "radiator"/heat exchanger absorbing
>>ambient heat and you could have a fridge at the bottom of the turbine
>>as a bonus (with electrical backup for low wind days, obviously).
>>
>>The question is:
>>How do heat pumps perform at variable speeds? Any refrigeration/ air
>>conditioning techs out there?
>>If the variable speed is a problem, any thoughts about solutions?
In an auto unit, a lot of the low speed performance has to do with how
the expansion is handled. You should be able to google that up. Note
also that auto units don't usually have the lifespan of home compressors
as they are not designed to run day in and day out.
Jeff
>
>
>
> Interesting idea. I would start by looking at autromotive style
> compressors. These work from an idle to highway speed. They are off
> the shelf items and you might find a good one in a juink yard to
> experiment with. The problem is these things are typically 2 ton units
> on an American car. That is a lot for a windmill to spin. Maybe one
> from a small foreign car would work.
> I don't know if the manufacturer's have specs somewhere on their sites
> or not. Ask around at the auto parts places to see who the main
> suppliers are these days for aftermarket compressors. They are more
> likely to have specs available.
Posted by markzoom on February 21, 2007, 9:03 am
> gfretw...@aol.com wrote:
> > On 20 Feb 2007 16:49:13 -0800, markz...@digiverse.net wrote:
> >>Just a thought...
> >>The average air conditioning heat pump will output over 3 times the
> >>input power in heat (in the heater configuration).
> >>So how about having the wind turbine run a heat pump compressor
> >>directly (no electricity)?
> >>Without the additional heat fom the motor, that would be over twice
> >>the rating of the wind turbine. IOW a 500 watt turbine should output
> >>1kw of heat (or cold). Up to you wether it's used for heating water or
> >>air.
> >>The mast could double as the "radiator"/heat exchanger absorbing
> >>ambient heat and you could have a fridge at the bottom of the turbine
> >>as a bonus (with electrical backup for low wind days, obviously).
> >>The question is:
> >>How do heat pumps perform at variable speeds? Any refrigeration/ air
> >>conditioning techs out there?
> >>If the variable speed is a problem, any thoughts about solutions?
> In an auto unit, a lot of the low speed performance has to do with how
> the expansion is handled. You should be able to google that up. Note
> also that auto units don't usually have the lifespan of home compressors
> as they are not designed to run day in and day out.
> Jeff
> > Interesting idea. I would start by looking at autromotive style
> > compressors. These work from an idle to highway speed. They are off
> > the shelf items and you might find a good one in a juink yard to
> > experiment with. The problem is these things are typically 2 ton units
> > on an American car. That is a lot for a windmill to spin. Maybe one
> > from a small foreign car would work.
> > I don't know if the manufacturer's have specs somewhere on their sites
> > or not. Ask around at the auto parts places to see who the main
> > suppliers are these days for aftermarket compressors. They are more
> > likely to have specs available.
Cheers, I'll look into car units.
Posted by markzoom on February 21, 2007, 9:14 am
On 21 Feb, 05:03, gfretw...@aol.com wrote:
> On 20 Feb 2007 16:49:13 -0800, markz...@digiverse.net wrote:
> >Just a thought...
> >The average air conditioning heat pump will output over 3 times the
> >input power in heat (in the heater configuration).
> >So how about having the wind turbine run a heat pump compressor
> >directly (no electricity)?
> >Without the additional heat fom the motor, that would be over twice
> >the rating of the wind turbine. IOW a 500 watt turbine should output
> >1kw of heat (or cold). Up to you wether it's used for heating water or
> >air.
> >The mast could double as the "radiator"/heat exchanger absorbing
> >ambient heat and you could have a fridge at the bottom of the turbine
> >as a bonus (with electrical backup for low wind days, obviously).
> >The question is:
> >How do heat pumps perform at variable speeds? Any refrigeration/ air
> >conditioning techs out there?
> >If the variable speed is a problem, any thoughts about solutions?
> Interesting idea. I would start by looking at autromotive style
> compressors. These work from an idle to highway speed. They are off
> the shelf items and you might find a good one in a juink yard to
> experiment with. The problem is these things are typically 2 ton units
> on an American car. That is a lot for a windmill to spin. Maybe one
> from a small foreign car would work.
> I don't know if the manufacturer's have specs somewhere on their sites
> or not. Ask around at the auto parts places to see who the main
> suppliers are these days for aftermarket compressors. They are more
> likely to have specs available.
Auto units sound like a good start for experimenting, thanks.
>The average air conditioning heat pump will output over 3 times the
>input power in heat (in the heater configuration).
>So how about having the wind turbine run a heat pump compressor
>directly (no electricity)?
>Without the additional heat fom the motor, that would be over twice
>the rating of the wind turbine. IOW a 500 watt turbine should output
>1kw of heat (or cold). Up to you wether it's used for heating water or
>air.
>The mast could double as the "radiator"/heat exchanger absorbing
>ambient heat and you could have a fridge at the bottom of the turbine
>as a bonus (with electrical backup for low wind days, obviously).
>The question is:
>How do heat pumps perform at variable speeds? Any refrigeration/ air
>conditioning techs out there?
>If the variable speed is a problem, any thoughts about solutions?