Posted by Bill on October 18, 2006, 8:41 pm
> Bill wrote:
>> >
>> > Bill wrote:
>> >> > Driving to work this morning the Red Triangle appeared on the video
>> >> > display with a picture of the battery and the word "Main" under it.
>> >> > The car run begins to act very strange with the IC engine RPM going
>> >> > very high. I pull over and turn off the car, when I try to restart
>> >> > it
>> >> > is completely dead.
>> >> >
>> >> > I get it towed to my local Toyota Dealer and after a few hours they
>> >> > call to tell me the main battery must be replaced. The good news is
>> >> > that the entire replacement cost is covered by the warranty.
>> >> >
>> >> > I purchased the Prius in Oct of 2000 and it has about 75K miles.
>> >> > Other
>> >> > than the recalls, this is the first trouble it has given.
>> >> >
>> >> > Has anyone else replaced the main battery yet?
>> >> >
>> >> > Does this mean the new battery will last 5 more years?
>> >> >
>> >> I haven't replaced mine. The new battery pack will last until it
>> >> fails.
>> >>
>> >> I'd like to hear from the Prius Techs as to whether or not one should
>> >> pull
>> >> over under these circumstances or keep driving to a more convenient
>> >> stopping
>> >> point such as a gas station with a towing service.
>> >
>> > In my case there was no option of driving to a more convenient place.
>> > The IC engine sounded like it was running 8,000 RPM and was producing
>> > very little power. I was just able to move accross the three lanes on
>> > I75 to the shoulder before it lost all power.
>> >
>> Sounds pretty grim. Eventually, every battery will fail, just like every
>> hard disk drive. I was hoping it would fall back to an ICE only
>> condition.
>> I suppose the main battery is running stuff necessary to ICE operation.
>> I
>> realize Toyota expects the battery to "last the life of the car" but
>> practically speaking about half of all cars are going to last longer than
>> the average of all cars.
> I have read many accounts of people running out of gas and the electric
> motor allowing them to limp to a gas station. But evidently the ICE is
> not very functional as a standalone power plant.
> It would have been nice if the Prius had provided a little more warning
> when the battery condition was nearing its end of life since the
> battery failure will immobilize the car.
I would appreciate your taking your case to Toyota and asking them to
engineer a fall-back to the ICE for future models. I'd do it myself, but
having evidence of a failed battery and having endured the consequence of
it's failure to fall-back gives you more credibility.
Posted by Allen on October 18, 2006, 8:50 pm
Bill wrote:
> >
> > Bill wrote:
> >> >
> >> > Bill wrote:
> >> >> > Driving to work this morning the Red Triangle appeared on the video
> >> >> > display with a picture of the battery and the word "Main" under it.
> >> >> > The car run begins to act very strange with the IC engine RPM going
> >> >> > very high. I pull over and turn off the car, when I try to restart
> >> >> > it
> >> >> > is completely dead.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I get it towed to my local Toyota Dealer and after a few hours they
> >> >> > call to tell me the main battery must be replaced. The good news is
> >> >> > that the entire replacement cost is covered by the warranty.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I purchased the Prius in Oct of 2000 and it has about 75K miles.
> >> >> > Other
> >> >> > than the recalls, this is the first trouble it has given.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Has anyone else replaced the main battery yet?
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Does this mean the new battery will last 5 more years?
> >> >> >
> >> >> I haven't replaced mine. The new battery pack will last until it
> >> >> fails.
> >> >>
> >> >> I'd like to hear from the Prius Techs as to whether or not one should
> >> >> pull
> >> >> over under these circumstances or keep driving to a more convenient
> >> >> stopping
> >> >> point such as a gas station with a towing service.
> >> >
> >> > In my case there was no option of driving to a more convenient place.
> >> > The IC engine sounded like it was running 8,000 RPM and was producing
> >> > very little power. I was just able to move accross the three lanes on
> >> > I75 to the shoulder before it lost all power.
> >> >
> >> Sounds pretty grim. Eventually, every battery will fail, just like every
> >> hard disk drive. I was hoping it would fall back to an ICE only
> >> condition.
> >> I suppose the main battery is running stuff necessary to ICE operation.
> >> I
> >> realize Toyota expects the battery to "last the life of the car" but
> >> practically speaking about half of all cars are going to last longer than
> >> the average of all cars.
> >
> > I have read many accounts of people running out of gas and the electric
> > motor allowing them to limp to a gas station. But evidently the ICE is
> > not very functional as a standalone power plant.
> >
> > It would have been nice if the Prius had provided a little more warning
> > when the battery condition was nearing its end of life since the
> > battery failure will immobilize the car.
> >
> I would appreciate your taking your case to Toyota and asking them to
> engineer a fall-back to the ICE for future models. I'd do it myself, but
> having evidence of a failed battery and having endured the consequence of
> it's failure to fall-back gives you more credibility.
I really doubt they would do anything for the 2001 version of the
Prius, they may of already addressed the problem in the new model.
Posted by Michael Pardee on October 23, 2006, 1:58 pm
> I have read many accounts of people running out of gas and the electric
> motor allowing them to limp to a gas station. But evidently the ICE is
> not very functional as a standalone power plant.
Not functional at all if the electrics fail; the electrics provide the
"ECVT" transmission action. It makes sense the ICE would rev freely under
those conditions. It is interesting that without the battery operating the
HV system is basically inoperable, but it's not terribly surprising.
> It would have been nice if the Prius had provided a little more warning
> when the battery condition was nearing its end of life since the
> battery failure will immobilize the car.
Like most of the other battery failures I've read about (mostly in the
Yahoo! forum), this one is almost certainly a failed connection inside the
battery pack. This is the first sudden total failure I've heard about,
though.
Mike
Posted by Curtis CCR on December 12, 2006, 4:48 pm
Michael Pardee wrote:
> >
> > I have read many accounts of people running out of gas and the electric
> > motor allowing them to limp to a gas station. But evidently the ICE is
> > not very functional as a standalone power plant.
> >
> Not functional at all if the electrics fail; the electrics provide the
> "ECVT" transmission action. It makes sense the ICE would rev freely under
> those conditions. It is interesting that without the battery operating the
> HV system is basically inoperable, but it's not terribly surprising.
To further describe it.
This is how "neutral" works. Since the gears in the tranny/diffy are
always engaged, neutral is achieved by disconneting all power from both
electric motors. This is why the batteries will not charge in neutral
- no power goes in or out of the MGs. In neutral, the ICE spins but
delivers no torque to the wheels as MG1 freewheels backward. Losing
the HV battery system will create the same condition - like putting the
selector in "N".
On the other hand, if you run out of gas, or the ICE otherwise fails,
you can "limp" around for a short time on MG2 until the batteries die.
Posted by Dick Byrd on October 18, 2006, 10:13 pm
The reason that the ICE just revs up with no power being delivered when
the main battery fails, is because the delivery of power to the ring gear of
the Power-Split-Device (and to the wheels) is dependent on there being power
delivered to MG-1 to counter the torque of the ICE. Otherwise the Sun gear
just spins and no torque is delivered to drive the car.
Dick
> Driving to work this morning the Red Triangle appeared on the video
> display with a picture of the battery and the word "Main" under it.
> The car run begins to act very strange with the IC engine RPM going
> very high. I pull over and turn off the car, when I try to restart it
> is completely dead.
> I get it towed to my local Toyota Dealer and after a few hours they
> call to tell me the main battery must be replaced. The good news is
> that the entire replacement cost is covered by the warranty.
> I purchased the Prius in Oct of 2000 and it has about 75K miles. Other
> than the recalls, this is the first trouble it has given.
> Has anyone else replaced the main battery yet?
> Does this mean the new battery will last 5 more years?
>
>> >
>> > Bill wrote:
>> >> > Driving to work this morning the Red Triangle appeared on the video
>> >> > display with a picture of the battery and the word "Main" under it.
>> >> > The car run begins to act very strange with the IC engine RPM going
>> >> > very high. I pull over and turn off the car, when I try to restart
>> >> > it
>> >> > is completely dead.
>> >> >
>> >> > I get it towed to my local Toyota Dealer and after a few hours they
>> >> > call to tell me the main battery must be replaced. The good news is
>> >> > that the entire replacement cost is covered by the warranty.
>> >> >
>> >> > I purchased the Prius in Oct of 2000 and it has about 75K miles.
>> >> > Other
>> >> > than the recalls, this is the first trouble it has given.
>> >> >
>> >> > Has anyone else replaced the main battery yet?
>> >> >
>> >> > Does this mean the new battery will last 5 more years?
>> >> >
>> >> I haven't replaced mine. The new battery pack will last until it
>> >> fails.
>> >>
>> >> I'd like to hear from the Prius Techs as to whether or not one should
>> >> pull
>> >> over under these circumstances or keep driving to a more convenient
>> >> stopping
>> >> point such as a gas station with a towing service.
>> >
>> > In my case there was no option of driving to a more convenient place.
>> > The IC engine sounded like it was running 8,000 RPM and was producing
>> > very little power. I was just able to move accross the three lanes on
>> > I75 to the shoulder before it lost all power.
>> >
>> Sounds pretty grim. Eventually, every battery will fail, just like every
>> hard disk drive. I was hoping it would fall back to an ICE only
>> condition.
>> I suppose the main battery is running stuff necessary to ICE operation.
>> I
>> realize Toyota expects the battery to "last the life of the car" but
>> practically speaking about half of all cars are going to last longer than
>> the average of all cars.
> I have read many accounts of people running out of gas and the electric
> motor allowing them to limp to a gas station. But evidently the ICE is
> not very functional as a standalone power plant.
> It would have been nice if the Prius had provided a little more warning
> when the battery condition was nearing its end of life since the
> battery failure will immobilize the car.