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how much power does it take to produce a solar panel? - Page 4

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Posted by dold on May 12, 2009, 12:29 am
 


That looks different in NREL Government pages.


No need to do math, when the US Government provides colored charts.
http://rredc.nrel.gov/solar/old_data/nsrdb/redbook/atlas/
"Flat plate facing south tilted at Latitude" is what I chose, and
I might say that roughly weighted for what I think are population centers,
and annual average of "5" would be about right.

Picking data for the top 10 cities in population,
http://rredc.nrel.gov/solar/codes_algs/PVWATTS/version1/US/code/pvwattsv1.cgi
New York City    4.56
Los Angeles    5.63
Chicago        4.42
Houston       4.79
Philadelphia    4.57
Phoenix       6.57
San Antonio    5.41
San Diego    5.77
Dallas       5.46
San Jose    5.45
   average    5.26


New York City shows an annual average of 4.56 kWh/m2/day, 2.85 in January,
5.78 in June.  Maybe I want Air Conditioning in the summertime more than I
want heat in the winter.


Or cost effective where electricity prices are high.
My PV installation is doing quite well, financially.

--
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA  GPS: 38.8,-122.5
http://cdold.home.mchsi.com/Solar-generation.htm  $775 avoided in 2008

Posted by T. Keating on May 5, 2009, 10:55 am
 
On Mon, 04 May 2009 11:27:33 +0200, Tomasz Chmielewski


It depends.. a lot...over 10x diff..  
   on type of PV technology used, where it's located, and the type of
mounting (dual axis tracking is the best). .  

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.energy/msg/869fdd7d1ad888d2?dmode=source

  Note: PV/Wind Energy payback time has been dropping year by year,
meanwhile fossil fuel/nuclear Energy payback times are increasing..
(As depletion occurs fossil fuels/uranium are harder to find,
mine/pump, increased  distance to transport, use more energy to
refine, etc.).

  Long term, (over hundreds of years) with recycling.  Energy costs
(glass, Al frame, Si, Cu) drop significantly and PV EROEI climbs to
~200 to 1 range..  Wind EROEI also climbs from the current ~80 - 120
to 1.. into ~200 to 1 range..

Posted by Mel on May 13, 2009, 9:17 am
 T. Keating a crit :

snip


I don't see how a fossil fuel / nuclear system can have an energy
payback time;you keep putting energy into to get energy out...

You can produce more energy than that required for the systems
construction & deconstruction, but you can't escape the fact that you
have to keep supplying it and that requires energy (transporting the
fuel, treating the fuel, running the system etc.. not to mention that
the conversion rate of the incoming energy is somewhere between 3 and 60%=
)

PV, and wind,on the other hand, ask for next to nothing once it's up and =

running, so you can have a real energy payback time.


Mel

Posted by mike-russell on May 5, 2009, 11:58 am
 You're right, there is considerable embodied energy in a solar panel,
however, as other contributors have said, this is reducing and is down
to less than 5 years. A lot of the embodied energy is in the frames.

I'm particularly interested in the First Solar product which is a
thin-film glass sandwich.  It's apparently 100% recyclable and even
has its collection costs built into the price.  Even the cadmium
telluride is collected for reuse.

The advertising blurb says it's less than US$ per watt and it's
frameless (which removes the aluminium's embodied component).

I believe it's only a matter of time before it's integrated into every
large window facing north (in Australia).

They're geared up to supply world-wide

Mike




On Mon, 04 May 2009 11:27:33 +0200, Tomasz Chmielewski



Posted by Mel on May 13, 2009, 9:18 am
 Tomasz Chmielewski a crit :

You can also check out : Report IEA-PVPS T10-01-2006

Compared assessment of selected environmental indicators of photovoltaic =

electricity in OECD cities

here : http://www.iea-pvps-task10.org/rubrique.php3?id_rubrique=4


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