Hybrid Car – More Fun with Less Gas

Re: Attn : Nick Pine - got a live one for ya ! Re: Too much humidity from my swamp cooler - Page 2

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Posted by Jim on September 17, 2007, 11:49 pm
 


    Pardon me for being thick; is he trying to run the motor in reverse, or
convert it to run in either direction at a flip of a switch????????
    inquiring minds want to know....



Posted by nicksanspam on September 18, 2007, 7:38 am
 


The latter, but after reading John's and daestrom's comments about brush
timing and fanblades, a separate room fan seems better, which seems to
recomplicate the damper arrangements needed to both heat water with
sunspace air and heat the room with the same radiator.
Maybe we need 2 radiators...

Nick

     Confusion is like fertilizer. It feels like shit,
     but nothing grows without it.    
                                      --Carl Rogers


Posted by nicksanspam on September 18, 2007, 8:08 am
 

Maybe another set of radiator fans. Or an AC fan in a room airpath vs
a hot airpath. Or back to a ceiling fan with lots of 4" PVC pipes
under a shiny ceiling. Most AC fans wouldn't last long at 150 F.

Maybe something like this, viewed in fixed font:

                  up         2'                  up
     -----------------------------          -----------
    |          r          s|      |       a|  radiator |
    |sunspace fa room     d|      |  room d|  and fan  |
    |     air  d air      a|      |   air a|           |
    |    <==  ai ==>  <== m| 2'   |   <== m|  sdamper  | 2'
    |          a          p|      |       p|           |
    |         nt          e|      |       e|           |
    |          o          r|  s   |       r|     4'    |
    |          r-----------|  u   |        |-----------| west
    |               2'     |  n   |        |           |
    |                      |  s   |        |           |
    |                      |  p   | 20'    |           |
    |                      |  a   |        |           |
    |                      |  c   | s      |           |
    |                      |  e   | o      |           |
    |                      |      | u      |           |
    -r                     |s     | t      |           |
    -o room       sunspace |d     | h      |           |
    -o  air            air |a     |        |           |
    -m  ==>            ==> |m     |        |  sdamper  |
    -f                     |p     |        |           |
    -a                     |e     |        |           |
    -n                     |r     |        |           |
     -----------------------------          -----------
                                                12'
                 adamper
     -----------------------------      Drawing not to scale.
    -          r     ^    s|s     |        
    -sunspace fa     |    d|d     |
    -     air  d   room   a|a     |
    -    <==  ai ==>air   m|m 4'  | 12' south
    -          a          p|p     |
    -         nt          e|e     |
    -          o    2'    r|r     |
     ----------r------------------
                   west

Will the room fan circulate warm air through the sunspace at night?
Motorizing one sdamper or making it heavy could fix that. The latter
would prevent desirable daytime sunspace thermosyphoning air...

Nick


Posted by nicksanspam on September 17, 2007, 8:41 am
 

He thought the brushes were replaceable, but the bearings usually went bad
by the time new brushes were needed...


I wonder if some sort of snubber circuit could help. Or a series choke?


Or a different field excitation? Synchronous PWM?


Would you have an url or some clues how to find them?


Sounds like you have to take them apart and move the brushes. We'd like
to run a single motor in both directions by reversing polarity. How long
would the unmodified fans last in reverse? We'd like the equivalent of
3000-4000 hours at 225 F, ie "forever" at 150 F. Nathan measured 60 watts
at full speed for the Mazda fans, but found no increase in heat transfer
above 30, with a PIC-based PWM drive. The fans turned at 1.2 watts. He
decided on 16, for the most part, vs a 400 W furnace blower :-) Perhaps
low power will make them last longer. I wonder why each fan has 4 wires.
Are there temp sensors in there?

A reversing fan would simplify things...

                  up         2'                  up
     -----------------------------          -----------
    |          r          s|      |       a|  radiator |
    |sunspace fa room     d|      |  room d|  and fan  |
    |     air  d air      a|      |   air a|           |
    |    <==  ai ==>  <== m| 2'   |   <== m|  sdamper  | 2'
    |          a          p|      |       p|           |
    |         nt          e|      |       e|           |
    |          o          r|  s   |       r|     4'    |
    |          r-----------|  u   |        |-----------| west
    |               2'     |  n   |        |           |
    |                      |  s   |        |           |
    |                      |  p   | 20'    |           |
    |                      |  a   |        |           |
    |                      |  c   | s      |           |
    |                      |  e   | o      |           |
    |                      |      | u      |           |
    -                      |s     | t      |           |
    - room        sunspace |d     | h      |           |
    -  air             air |a     |        |           |
    -  ==>             ==> |m     |        |           |
    -                      |p     |        |  sdamper  |
    -                      |e     |        |           |
    -                      |r     |        |           |
     -----------------------------          -----------
                                                12'
                 adamper
     -----------------------------     Drawing not to scale.
    -          r    ^     s|s     |        
    -sunspace fa    |     d|d     |
    -     air  d room     a|a     |
    -    <==  ai  air     m|m 4'  | 12' south
    -          a          p|p     |
    -         nt          e|e     |
    -          o    2'    r|r     |
     ----------r------------------
                 west

Thanks for the definitive answer, John :-)

Nick


Posted by Jim on September 17, 2007, 11:47 pm
 

    Aaahhh so. Number One Son is learning.


    We used to have a cartoon in the window of our parts dept w/a guy
holding one, saying "I need everything but this for an '87 Taurus."  :-)



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